This week we saw the sanctuary city showdown, as some called it.

Denver Mayor Mike Johnson was in the hot seat in Washington defending the city's immigration policies before Congress.

Meanwhile, one of our leaders already in Washington is considering coming back to Colorado permanently to be governor.

But first, will our current governor, Jared Polis, pardon Tina Peters?

Yes, her legal case is back in the news and back in the conversation on this week's Colorado Inside-Out, Hi, everyone.

I'm Kyle Dyer.

Let me get right to introducing you to this week's insider panel.

We have Patti Calhoun, founder and editor of Westword.

Eric Solomon, columnist for Colorado Politics and the Denver and Colorado Springs Gazette.

Krista Kafer, a columnist with The Denver Post.

And Kristi Burton Brown, executive vice president at Advanced Colorado and former chair of the Colorado Republican Party.

It was a demanding week for Denver Mayor Mike Johnson, who only spent 6 hours testifying in front of a congressional panel in Washington talking about the city's immigration policies.

And then here at home, state lawmakers are demanding from the city government to provide more security in and around the Capitol building because of problems with safety there.

It's been a big week for the mayor.

Patty, I'll start with you.

It was a big week.

I watched all 6 hours of that hearing.

The surprise was when all of a sudden Jim Jordan of Ohio came up with Abraham Gonzales, someone who was released after almost a year in the Denver jails, gave ice, what, 90 minutes notice.

And I sat there as he was released in the parking lot.

And somehow with six ICE agents, he managed to hit one and bite one and he had to be tased.

So that was a surprise.

But he dealt well with it.

The Colorado contingent a little disappointing, I thought.

Lauren Boebert spoke too fast, spoke too early, little off.

Then we had the jump on with Jeff Crank, and we had Gabe Evans, who's been sending endless pat on the back pieces.

Jeff Hurd was the real surprise at the very, very end.

He came up with some really thoughtful questions and got Johnson to talk in a very sensible, interesting way about the city.

So all in all, a really long 6 hours, but we came out alive.

I think Mayor Johnston more than acquitted himself.

We had a discussion a month ago around this table whether he should go or whether he should not go.

I think it was the right thing to be there at $1,000 an hour called discounted rate for the attorneys that prepped Mayor Johnson.

He should have been well prepared.

And he was.

If you have the either good fortune or misfortune of being seated between Mayor Eric Adams of New York City and Mayor Brandon Johnson of Chicago, it is not all that difficult to look good in that particular company.

I think the bigger issue we need to get to here is the whole debate over sanctuary cities.

I think You know, is Denver a welcoming city or is Denver a sanctuary city?

It's all semantics as far as I'm concerned.

A lot of those on the right who are going to say Denver is a sanctuary city and there are certainly elements of truth to that.

You know, I don't remember them being quite so outspoken when there were Colorado sheriffs around the state who are refusing to enforce gun laws because they disagreed with gun laws.

this country still hasn't had the serious debate about a big immigration fix.

We're still dealing with the sidebar issues, as far as I'm concerned, Krista.

So Marjorie Taylor GREENE, AOC, Nancy Mace and Lauren Boebert walk into a bar, I mean, hearing room.

And we had that 6 hours of hearing, right?

I, I call it a hearing.

I think that's what it's called.

But was anyone actually hearing anything?

I think it is It is a very good question.

Our mayor comported himself very well.

He was very thoughtful talking about the city, talking about the fact that we had a lot of people coming in.

It was 83,000 in the middle of winter.

And rather than just throw them on busses or throw them out in the cold, we took care of those people just thought he was a lot more thoughtful than the people that were asking him questions.

And I was not impressed with the showboating that went on.

The fact is, is that these members of Congress just months ago had in front of them a bill that would have tightened up the border, tightened up the language for credible fear, and made it easier to turn away people who are coming here as economic migrants.

They had that in front of them.

They chose not to act on it because it was right before an election.

So it's hard to take them seriously.

I don't is basically 6 hours of wasted time.

And your take.

So I have a different take.

I think when we look at sanctuary city status that Denver has sanctuary state status, that the state has.

And we see what Mayor Johnson said up in D.C. we see that violent crime is really the issue that's top of mind for most voters.

There's 80% of Americans who say that they believe violent criminals and repeat felons should be reported to ICE and deported.

And it was exposed at this hearing that Denver doesn't even track how many illegal immigrants are committing violent crime in this city.

I think that's a gang member example that Patti brought up a few minutes ago is so important.

Not only did ICE request a 48 hour notice before this person was released so that they could go get them and then deport them.

And Denver responded by giving them a 90 minute prior email notification.

What was also exposed is that the handoff happens in the parking lots.

It does not happen in the jails where it should happen, where our officers will be safe, where the community is not at risk.

There is some real issues with how Denver handles that, reporting it to ice of violent criminals.

They're not reporting all of them.

They're not coordinating in the right ways.

And I think the majority of Americans want to see reform on that.

Justin did say that, maybe we should change things up and have people come inside.

I wonder what will come of that.

Well, he said it called them.

I think we'll see a lot of those lawyers getting a workout because everyone said there will be more investigating.

People are still saying we want them thrown in jail.

We want them charged.

The mayor is charged.

So those lawyers will be building a lot more.

1000 hours.

And charging the mayors, I don't think gets us anywhere.

I think what this really is, is we need to focus in on keeping our community safe When Denver can't even say how many gang members are here.

When the Venezuelan gang has made Denver their headquarters because of Denver sanctuary city policies like the policy and the law is what really needs to change.

And I'm not sure I heard Johnston say that he was going to welcome or even consider welcoming the ICE officers inside the jails.

I heard him talk more vaguely about being open to discussion about protocols.

I think Christi raises a fair and interesting question of is it better to happen in a chase in a parking lot or is it better to happen in more of a controlled environment inside?

I know that goes against a lot of quote unquote, progressive dogma that you can't invite ICE into local facilities.

But in my mind, is it at least a valid question?

This week brought more protests to Colorado in Rocky Mountain National Park in Boulder outside the state capitol again on Tuesday, all in response to actions taken by the administration.

And ahead of the president's, a joint session of Congress address the other night.

Eric.

This has been a very eventful week.

I will start with you.

this was a speech that was directed entirely at Trump's base.

I, he, he, he rang every chord to make that base stand up and cheer.

And those on the Republican side of the aisle in Congress, Lord knows, they stood up and cheered.

They got their aerobic work out for the evening with all the ups and downs.

The Democrats, on the other hand, just lack a coherent strategy of how to approach this president.

Maybe that will come over time.

I do think Alissa Slotkin response, the formal response new senator from Michigan, was artfully done and we might have witnessed the beginnings of a star being born there.

My underscore of this speech was it just drove home how deeply polarized we are and how deeply polarized we may we remain, and that there are very few forces out there really trying to do anything about that core polarization.

Krista?

we see the market responding.

We see protesters responding.

But what we don't see is the Democrat Party standing up and offering as, as Eric said, a coherent vision of something that's different.

And I think we're going to need that.

I, I have a hunch that if things continue the way they are now, we're going to see a number of Republican seats lost in the next election, as people say, you know what, I don't I want to make sure that my local park is taken care of.

I want to make sure that there are enough people around to fight fire, fight to fight forest fires.

I want to make sure that my business is able to get the products it needs.

Just read that.

Colorado could miss 1.5 billion a year to lose that much just from tariffs.

We've got some very serious things on the horizon and I don't think that the leaders are listening.

I think they're actually going to continue to go full steam ahead.

I think there's no question that President Trump is shaking things up, whether you look economically, whether you look internationally.

And that's one reason I think Marco Rubio as secretary of state is so vital.

He brings a maturity to the diplomacy that I think we really need in the United States of America.

But what I think we saw in that speech, I actually disagree that President Trump was speaking only to the base.

You actually saw him speak about a number of 80, 20 issues, including that little boy, 13 year old boy, 13 surgeries with brain cancer, I believe.

And Trump made him a Secret Service agent, an honorary member, and Democrats couldn't even clap for that.

You saw President Trump announce the renaming of a wildlife reserve for a little girl who was killed by a violent illegal immigrant who was already criminal.

Shouldn't have been here.

Democrats couldn't even clap for that.

And so I think what he masterfully did is he exposed the Democrats.

They don't just have a messaging problem.

They have a policy problem right now.

And that's something that they're going to need to resolve if they do have a hope of taking back any power in 2026.

And I'm not talking Colorado, but nationally is they're going to need to solve their divergence from average Americans on these key issues, largely involving public safety, where the Republican Party on economics and public safety are with the American people.

And I think President Trump is illustrating that very well.

Well, he's shaking things up, if you like, whiplash.

So 30 hours from now, we'll find out.

Maybe the tariffs will have been reversed four more times and when they will start and who will get them.

And we're going to find out again.

Ukraine help, not help.

It's so speedy.

And I watched all 2 hours of that show, too.

It took me and it took an hour before we got what I knew would come.

Aurora, when they said it was been ruined, wrecked by Venezuelan gangs.

And I think let's be realistic.

Denver does know there's gang activity from a variety of gangs.

I think they know probably exactly what percentage of those gangs are Venezuelan gangs.

Aurora was late to the party and getting a grip on it, but they have it now.

That city is not wrecked.

But I think Trump's messaging, he was smart on some of the people he had there, but his message was all over the map and he has to find some policies and be consistent on that.

Okay.

Before we move forward, I want to talk about the administration's desires to close the federal Department of Education.

To do so, Congress legally would have to get involved.

So it's not going to happen right away.

But there are things in the works.

And I'm just curious, Christie, you recently joined the state Board of Education as a volunteer elected member of the board.

What would this mean for Colorado education and schools?

That's a great question.

And there's a lot of people, I think, that get hung up on the headlines closing the Department of Education.

But I think what does that mean in reality?

Closing the Department of Education means ending bureaucracy at the federal level.

This actually should be good news for Colorado.

We're a very local focused state.

We think our local district should have more say over education than the state.

So we also here in Colorado should believe that the state should have more say than the federal government.

So I think ending the bureaucracy at the department, education does not equal cutting funding.

That's what people are afraid of.

Trump has never said that he wants to take funding from kids education.

Ending bureaucracy is a very different thing.

We need to get our scores up.

We need to get our kids excited about being in school.

And you just hear these headlines and worry that it will affect teachers and their ability to teach.

Sure.

And none of us want that.

On the state Board of Education, we often talk about raising teacher salaries.

So that's what we would want to see across the board.

It's not a political issue, and I think making sure our kids can achieve.

We need to keep the federal funding coming to Colorado, and I don't think that's at risk right now.

Kristi makes an absolutely valid point about that.

We're not talking about getting rid of all the functions of the Department of Education.

And parenthetically, I might note that I think getting complete abolishment of that department through Congress is going to be very difficult, even a Republican Congress.

But we're not talking about getting rid of all the functions.

We're talking about more efficiently aligning those functions with other federal departments and returning some of those functions to the state.

At the same time, a lot of the funding just flows through as block grants without the Department of Education being a middleman, it is at least an interesting conversation to have without everyone instinctively running to their corners, either pro or con.

I used to be a contractor for the department and I can honestly say that I don't think it'll be missed.

It's not that it didn't.

What really matters is what goes on in the classroom.

It's between the teacher and the student.

It's not some bureaucracy that's several thousand miles away that dispenses grants.

And if anything, the department uses sort of the carrot and stick approach of sort of dangling cash for very popular fads that it thinks are a good idea, which may or may not work for a particular group of kids.

why not just let states keep the money to begin with and use it according to their own priorities?

The Department of Justice says it is going to revisit and review the Tina Peters conviction.

Peters is the former Mesa County clerk who is a few months into serving her nine year prison sentence for breaching voting machines while looking for potential election irregularities.

Krista, I'll start with you on this.

We've talked about this case a lot at this table.

She was convicted by a jury of her peers.

Right.

And the administration can't say that we trust states and trusts localities and then go and say, well, we're not going to trust that particular locality, that particular judge.

I mean, either either you trust locals or you don't.

And she had her time in court.

She had a lawyer.

She was able to testify.

She talked about what she did.

Part of the reason that she got such a stiff sentence is that she wasn't the least bit sorry.

She was glad that what she did in compromising those those machines and still continue to hold on to those conspiracy theories.

And so given her attitude and the fact that she had no remorse, she got a heavy sentence of trying to counter counter remind our judge and our jury is it's not what democracy is all about.

And I think they need to let her sit and consider her crimes and stay where she's at.

Okay.

I think there's a couple of angles here.

First, as you know, I was the Colorado chairman when she ran for secretary of state and then lost the primary.

And I made an unusual statement as GOP chairman.

And I came out and said, if you were charged with a felony, you should not be running in the Republican primary.

That in part, she was accused of kicking a police officer.

She actually showed me how she did it.

And I you know, I find that to be very disturbing.

And as a leader of the party at the time, I said this is not who should be running for our office.

And so I think she did go through a real trial.

She did have a real prosecution.

These are state and local crimes that she committed.

So the federal level can't actually come in and give her a pardon because it's the state and the local level get to decide.

The other angle I will take is I will say nine years for what she did.

When we compare the sentence that a lot of violent criminals get in Colorado, does seem a little excessive to me.

I wouldn't attribute that to a political prosecution, though.

She can go through the appeals process and that's what she needs to do if she wants to lower her sentence.

It's not necessary for the federal government to step in here.

And I don't think she's a good model for conservatives to follow.

We have to remember, she did kick a police officer.

So it wasn't just, you know, the waitress at the restaurant where she was that day.

We had a Republican D.A.

in Mesa County who was the one involved in this prosecution.

You have, again, a jury of her peers.

State and local laws are what she violated.

The feds have no business being in it.

But right now, the feds are getting into a lot of things they have no business being in.

This is an executive order about weaponized version of the Justice Department.

Let's hope that they are not able to do anything that she can appeal her sentence.

But she definitely was convicted fairly and she's not contrite.

Let's hope.

Maybe Mike Lindell has given her a pillow to use in stir, but otherwise no special favors.

Okay, Eric.

This is Donald Trump's Department of Justice and they are following through with two of Donald Trump's most oft repeated claims.

Number one is that the second term was going to be in significant part about retribution.

His quote was, I am your retribution.

This is trying to go for one of his supporters, trying to get one of his supporters out of the jam enact retribution against those who prosecuted her.

And the second is, it's just doubling down on the big lie.

The big lie that Peters was trying to prove unsuccessfully that the 2020 election was somehow stolen.

Donald Trump and most of the people around Donald Trump have never acknowledged and will never acknowledge that he lost that election fair and square.

Tina Peters All of everything that flowed and all of what she ended up being prosecuted for and convicted of was a consequence of the big lie.

Okay.

Let's talk about the political chess games that are playing out among future leaders here in Colorado and what our state will look like leadership wise in the next many years when it comes to the Colorado GOP.

We know that there will be a new head of party because Dave Williams has announced that he will not run again in March.

Also, there are Republicans and a prominent Democrat eyeing the job of Governor Christie.

As you mentioned, you were the head of the Colorado GOP before Dave Williams came on board.

What do you expect for the party going forward?

Well, I think it's good news that Dave Williams isn't running again.

I think what the Republican Party needs here in Colorado is a respectful leader, someone who can be respected and who can show respect.

I think we are not in the majority here in Colorado.

That's reality right now.

I think it's really incredible.

It gave Evans was able to flip CD8 and the House minority was able to take back three seats.

So there's there's some movement here for Republicans in Colorado.

But I think to continue that, we need someone who can focus on issues.

That's not what Dave Williams was able to effectively do.

No issues that resonated with Colorado citizens.

So the next leader will not be him.

And whoever it is needs to be someone who can draw back that focus onto respectful dialog about issues that compel citizens to take a look at Republican candidates.

So I'm hopeful that that may happen.

The election will be on March 29th.

We'll we'll see who the next leaders.

And are their names in the running that you think are those people?

Well, I think right now Brett Horn is the one who's in now.

Of the three who've announced right now, I think she's the only one of the three who really could take the party forward in a competent, respectful fashion.

Okay.

Patty.

It would be refreshing just not to have people who are ethically conflicted, breaking the rules and opening a bigger tent door for the Republicans there.

People who are concerned about the Democratic Party.

We have enough unaffiliated voters in Colorado that you can imagine.

Some of them would go to the Republican Party if they saw some real leadership and just more willingness to think about other positions, not go to the far right.

And then maybe you could actually get someone through a primary who might have a better chance at a statewide race.

The Democrats are going to be fascinating because the bench is pretty full and we're seeing a lot of people thinking about getting into the governor's race, into the AG's race with the Republicans.

We have two who've already declared for the governorship.

I don't think either of them are going anywhere.

And this week we heard Michael Bennet considering leaving D.C. and running for governor.

Yeah, I'll get there.

And let me just start by saying there's only one place in the state of Colorado where Dave Williams will be missed that is around this table because he's the gift that has kept on giving for our weekly discussions.

But of course, everyone is right that the Colorado GOP and state politics as a whole will be better off without him.

To your question, Kyle.

Yeah.

The governor's race with Jared, Paul and now being in its final two years is is picking up interest.

I mean, the primary election will be it's only, what, 15, 16 months away, something like that.

And you know, Phil Weiser was first in.

Now we have the rumor or the trial balloon about Michael Bennet.

I think that says as much about how awful it is to be a U.S. senator, particularly U.S. senator of the minority party, as it does necessarily about the governor's chair.

But Michael Bennet is a formidable person, both intellectually and politically.

You have the notion of Ken Salazar, former U.S. senator, who bedded coincidentally replaced possibly getting in.

You have Congressman Joe Neguse, who's a powerhouse in his own right, who is carefully looking at the race.

And then you have Jennifer Griswold, who, despite all of her other flaws and everything that all the water she took on last cycle, I do not completely dismiss her chances, particularly as the sole female in a party that loves female candidates in a multi-candidate primary.

I don't completely dismiss that either.

Okay, Krista.

I'm going to miss Dave.

Let's go.

Brandon Williams.

I whenever I you know, just getting ready to write a column and didn't have anything to say and there was no issues that stood out.

All I'd have to do is look at what he had tweeted or said or done, and I could have a column right there.

So he will be missed.

He has been an impediment to that, to to the Republican Party growing, existing, being effective in the least.

And so having him out, I think, could be a new day for Republicans.

Brett Horn is a great gal.

I think she would do a great job.

Perhaps there are others that could well, anyone could do a better job than Dave, but getting somebody in there that can begin to recruit and bring people to the party to show that the Republicans are the party of of not conspiracy theories and craziness, but that Republicans stand for limited government, individual responsibility and freedom, and championing that message so that people will start to come back to the party.

You're not interested, are you, in possibly taking their position again?

The middle.

Thank you.

That was our last really good, good leader there.

Okay.

All right now let's go down the line with each of you talking about a high and the low this week.

We'll start on the low note so we can end on a high note.

We're start with Patty.

The fight at the legislature and outside the legislature over restaurants has gotten really, really bitter.

Let's hope everyone can take a breath.

Both sides pull back and celebrate.

Denver Restaurant Week, which starts today.

That's right, Eric.

Just everything that has gone down in the Oval Office and between the Trump administra ation and Ukraine, we have totally lost sight of who are our allies are and who our adversaries are.

We have made Canada in many respects an adversary and Putin's Russia in many respects a friend and ally that is upside down and backwards in my mind.

Okay I was outraged to see the treatment of Zelinsky by our leaders when he was here as a guest in our country.

And I'm with Eric.

We strained to to look at those that have always done us harm as friends and looking at our friends as though they were our enemies.

And that's just wrong.

Christie I want to go back to the speech Trump gave in Congress this week and seeing the sea of Democrat women wearing pink days after they voted against protecting women in sports.

I think that is another key issue, and it's really unfortunate to see a group of women.

I'm a mother of a daughter and see see women saying they're standing up for women while voting against women being safe in sports.

That's a real low for me.

Okay.

Now let's talk about something positive.

How hard to miss that one.

So I'll kind of go to International Women's Day and Week, which is tomorrow.

Go to the Women's History Museum on Bannock Street.

It's open.

It's free.

Great exhibits to celebrate the progress women have made.

Okay, good.

I have never held back and won't hold back in my criticisms of this president and this administration.

And that said, I want to say nice things about two of his senior appointees who are both from Colorado, Chris Wright, who is the secretary of Energy, Kathleen Sgamma, who has been nominated to lead the Bureau of Land Management.

Whether you agree with them on every issue, whether you share their proclivities in favor of the oil and gas community is almost beside the point.

Donald Trump won this election.

He's entitled The People in his cabinet of his viewpoint.

Both Chris right and Kathleen Sgamma are quality human beings.

They are accomplished professionals and good for them, for their new positions and good for the country.

Okay.

I don't know Jenna Griswald personally, but I was happy to see justice done on her behalf.

Somebody that had been threatening her has gone to jail and will be in jail for the next two years.

And I think it just I hope it speaks a message to any would be people out there who threaten public officials or or columnists, anybody who's in the public with death threats, that you can be prosecuted and you can go to jail.

Okay.

All right.

I think criticize what goes on in Denver at the Capitol.

But I think the high point is there's been some really thoughtful pieces of legislation recently run.

One of them, what I've done with California, did on retail theft.

And every single county in California voted for this in November would have cracked down on like the smash and grab gangs.

There was a bill run by Jarvis Caldwell, a new representative that would have done the same thing here in Colorado.

It did get shot down in committee.

But I think the fact that he's running thoughtful bills like that is a new legislator, one that can resonate across the board.

We need to see more of that.

So I love it when new legislators are able to do that.

Okay.

My high has nothing to do with politics.

My high is that March is finally here.

And for the first time, a long time, my Maryland Terps are commended on the court and they are winning big games like the one Wednesday night against Michigan.

Sorry, Michigan fans out there.

So bring on March Madness and fear the turtle.

All right.

Sincere thanks to all of you.

Christi, thank you for joining us.

Your first time here in color inside out.

Thank you all for watching at home or listen along to our podcast.

I am Kyle Dyer.

I will see you next week here on PBS 12.

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