>>Hello and welcome to a special edition of Global Perspectives.

I'm David Dumke.

Toda we're pleased to share with you the third and final installmen of our series of conversations from the Bosphorus Summit in Istanbul, Turkey.

We'll begin this wee with my discussion with Gerardo Zamora Governor of Santiago, Argentina, and quite possibly a presidential candidate.

His topic of interest for the Bosphorus Summit?

Economics.

Specifically, what is being done to strengthen the economy of Argentina?

Thank you for taking the time to join us today.

>>A pleasure.

Thank you.

Pleasure to talk to you.

I'd like to hear your thoughts a little on on the Argentinean economy.

There's been a lot written about it, about some of the policies that have been implemented by the president.

I'd like to hear your take o where Argentina is economically.

>>Argentina came from many years with a fiscal deficit and there were and we had to overcome many economic obstacles.

We had an important deb not only for the private sector but also with the IMF, an we have to roll over that debt.

So when the government assumed it was a very difficult situation because we had no international credit, so it's true that some measures were required.

We needed to get to the expenses down.

But I want to mention that I am the governor of one of the 23 Argentine provinces, we have a federal system, and the provinces are the owners of the natural resources, the land.

And it's not the provinces who had generated this difficul economic situation and the debt.

And that we are suffering because we have stopped a public expense on infrastructure, and we are not receiving the funds for that.

So there is tensio between the federal government and the provinces.

But this is not you know this is something that this is something that I think that now is worse.

I must say that I am not from the political party, from the central government, I am the head of the governor of Santiago del Estero which is a very big problems with a huge land, about 1 million inhabitants approximately.

I belong to a coalition of political parties from my own province, and we have a great agricultural capacity and we can export.

We give more than what we take from the trade balance.

So we do agree that some expenses needed to be reduced.

But we are worried.

We are worried because we have had less consumer and economic activity in the last months, and we are afrai that there is maybe a recession.

And so we are hoping to see the economic situation get stabilized and we are going to overcome this moment.

>>What are some of the steps you are taking in Santiago specifically to strengthe the economy in your own governor - government?

>>Well, we have a province that we know that we have been governing for 20 years, and we had a fiscal [UNINTELLIGIBLE] And so we took many different policies, counter-cyclical to avoid recession.

We have assumed a infrastructure that was abandoned by the central government.

We are talking about water infrastructure and housing, for different kinds of housing, but also social requirements, like for example, we have a special program on medicines for different requirements.

Also, we made policie to recover the full employment.

So but I have to say that we are not an island.

We ar we are in a recessive context, but we have a very important dialog with the central government.

And again, I would say tha some measurements are required to be taken.

But for example, we still have inflation.

We had 2.5% inflation the last month.

And that means less consumer and less of the salaries are stretched in real terms.

And that has a direct impact in the families.

We think that in 2026 there is we hope in 2026 there will be a reactivation of the federal level.

And that will also impact in the in the province.

My my province is a province hopeful.

And he grew in a very important in a significant way in the last 20 years.

>>Thank you for that explanation.

There's been a lot there's been a lot written about Argentin and the United States recently, particularly since President Trump gave some financial assistance to the federal government in Argentina.

That's run by the other othe party, President Milei's party.

How did that go over among argentineans that U.S.

involvement in Argentinean economic affairs right at the time of an election?

>>Well, we do not have much inside information about financial assistance.

We we do know the former declarations made by both presidents and even prime ministers coordinate action.

And we we know that this calms certain, anxiety and stress that they're watching the market.

And we think that these helped also President Milei in his midterm election.

But this subject has not been, submitted to and debated in the Congress.

So I cannot go any further on that word.

But I want to say I am, representing ten provinces from the northern part of Argentina, and that's why I am here at the Bosphorus Summit.

And these ten provinces are governed by politicians and political partie from different political origin and science.

And and we all agree that we have to have a good relationship with the U.S., and we think that both countries have to keep that in mind, and we have to make it so it's not between on president and other presidents, because I think that institutions have to be above the one president in particular, one person.

And also, I would like to to stress that the world is is suffering great political tensions.

I think I might it I can say in the name of all the other politicians that I represent, that we really want a great relationship with the U.S., but also with the rest of the world.

So we hope that Argentina can be a great player in this, new context, because we do have food products, strategic minerals, natural resources or forestry, ecosystem services.

And we have a population that is freely open and work hard worker.

And we think this is something that the world needs, and we want to focus on this in order to have more peace and better relationships.

Because Argentina knew stressful times and you know, knew how to stood up.

So it's a resilient country.

>>Are you concerned, especially you in in your own province, you have mentione that agriculture is important.

And foreign trade therefore is also important because a lot of agriculture products, of course, are exported.

Are you concerned that there's a global trend of more protectionism right now that would hurt Argentina?

Both the northern part that you're representing at this conference.

But in general, going forward.

>>I should say that Argentina in a certain way is going against this tendency that you mentioned about the protectionist trend because we are opening our markets, we are using our export export products in a certain way.

Not protecting the national manufacturing industry.

We are concerned that we might become one day because we are leaders in expor of commodities like soy, corn, and we - we don't want to be taxed, in a country that explores their basic primary products, we would like to have also to, to export to we, an industrialized product manufacture products.

So this is a concern from many parts from the society because the industry is, is suffering from these opening o the import, the import products.

Most of from countries or China.

And in some way, this kind of contradiction.

Besides, the trade current policy.

Argentina is offering great opportunities too.

>>So I have just one question and we'll try to do this briefly, even though it's could be a long answer.

If you at the federal level, what three things can Argentina do to improve the economy?

[SPEAKING SPANISH] >>Briefly.

>>Well it is a compromise.

It's going to be hard.

But I going to try to do a to do what you are asking me.

So I will say that the first problem it will be the currency exchange rate structure.

And, but I think that it's it's not in the right place, not very competitive.

The second point, I would say that the limitation that we still have for businesses to exchange US dollars to, pesos, that that has an impact in - in inversion investment.

And the third point would be if you've added value to the manufacturing industry, and, this fourth point, we have more agreements with the countries.

So have a better agreement, trade agreements.

The fifth point would be infrastructure we need, we need foods, we need water.

We need to energy infrastructure.

>>Governor, thank you so much for joining us today.

We sure appreciate you sharing your thoughts.

>>Muchas gracias, thank you very much.

>>Ou next guest is YoungHoon Kwaak, president of the United Nations Association of Korea and World Citizen Organization South Korea.

While Kwaak is most renowned for his work as a gifted urban architect, including the 1988 Seoul Olympic Park, his interests in attending the Bosphorus Summit was discuss the challenges of sustainable development facing community leaders worldwide.

>>Doctor thank you for joining us today.

You you've been talking a lot about sustainable development and direction of where the world should go with it.

Can you explain a little about some of the theories?

>>You know everything has to be sustained if it is a good thing.

It shouldn't be sustained if it is hurting.

The only one planet Earth and it it's it's a, you know, you call quality luck.

But the, we have some troubles.

In terms of waste, in terms of, temperature, in terms of, you know, the social integration of these troubled.

So I think it's a good time to think about, what to do.

So the first thing to say is that people should, recognize this action, reaction production, and then the waste, this equal in, in physics.

So instead of making only goods, and thinking about it, finish.

But when you make goods, you ar making equal quantity of bads.

But you don't have this term bads, which means it's not in the cognition of human beings that they are bads.

Those word which has these semantics of bads.

Did you get the point?

So I think the first thing to do is to have people recognize or cognize the amount of bads.

Same amount of bads will be coming out when you making goods.

So that's number one in terms of materials because we need materials.

And from that, cognition, that you would be creating a lot of things to.

Get rid of or not causing.

Bad.

But that's a material but also, you know, for sustainability, the problem is, in the realm of service.

Right?

It's not just materials, but in human civilization, there are many fields of business and so on.

Oh, politics or whatever.

The industrial society, they always have parallel to, goods production.

There's a service area and in the name of service now with AI and all these things, they also have this.

Semantics or word, which doesn't make people to understand that there is such a thing, that is nervous.

So wrong information, bad information.

It's nervous in the name of service as parallel to goods are making for the goods.

But actually they are making bads and they don't take care of it.

It goes down to the bottom of ocean and things like that in the plastics problem.

And you get back to human being.

And so we are doomed in a way.

And sustainability is gone because of these two kinds of, recognition.

So that's the beginning thoughts I have.

>>When Ban Ki-moon was, selected as the U.N.

Secretary-General, I asked him a couple of things because, his closest friend and I helped him to become the candidate from, Korea, as I mentioned in the speech, that I want you to think about two things.

That is sustainability of various things, as you know, 13, 14, 15, 16 and also justice for gender equality and inclusion.

So that I calls sort of social justice.

So I asked him to hire equal number of ladies to partake in the global affairs, especially in multilateral, cooperation, which U.N.

is therefore so he understood that he made, as you know, from MDG - Millennium Development Goals, to SDG.

So that's one other thing I have done.

And then he made the badge and he has done all that.

And then by year 2030, only five years left.

They tried to achieve all these, agendas.

And unfortunately nobody believes that.

And some political I wouldn't like to call leaders, but pseudo leaders, are going against it.

And I don't want to mention who that is and or wh or the kinds of people they are.

So people are concerned about democracy as well.

They think it is hypocrisy rather than, you know, genuinely concerned for the welfare of people.

So as far as sustainability, agenda, I have in my mind is to think more deeply, in the psyche and the mechanism of present, Homo sapiens up here in the civilization.

That brings me to think about not only.

War in the territorial war, in various places in the north of here.

South of here.

Gaza, Ukraine.

I happen to be the North and South.

That's of against the grain of this subject we are talking about in real terms.

>>Doctor do you see a difference between you've done a lot of work connecting citizens.

>>Right.

>>Do you see a difference between conversations betwee citizens of different countries and leaders of different countries at this point?

>>Absolutely.

They are different, much different, much, much different.

And the difference I don't know, condemn as long as it's, difference of personality, the difference of where they are from nation state, religion or race or whatnot.

So I'm not against th differences in the leadership, but, that really made me to think that there are moral or ethical.

So, basic grounds for human being to have this honesty, integrity and of this kind of virtues, public values, values in public life, the leadership should be showing there's a some discrepancy between what they say and what they do.

This is causing the problems to me.

I talked to a lot of people, but I no don't know whether they ar sincerely believing it or not.

So I like to see what they say and what they do.

What the deliver would should be consistent differently because of their living situations.

Do I don't want to again mention some people's name.

You would understand immediately, but if they say such a good nice things, but daily life is doing opposite, they are using too much energy for their own House.

They are really, it's it's garbages amazingly, they produce in their backyard.

And this, integrity matter is troubling me.

And what would be the education needed so that people would be really consistent in what they say and what they do and what the how they live, how they practice, how to relate seems as though people tend to say things political reasons and and then it's just said, like movie acting.

But real him-- >>Very different than reality.

>>Very different to reality.

And what do we do?

What made things worse is, I'm sorry to say, mass media tends to aggrandize this, hidden problems in a negative way, and they are equally acting so.

So I feel, mass media' responsibility is also ingrained in this troubled time for humanity.

>>What can we do to actually have people focus more on reality, not on rhetoric?

As we're, as we're saying, both the leadership level and the people.

People level.

>>No one has to learn, to detox.

Wrong learning.

I call that "delearning" or sometimes unlearning.

People learn the wrong way, but the think that's the way to do it.

Make a simple example.

I don't know why.

Is it really directly relevant?

And people might be wondering why I say this, but there is a truth in this.

When the when you learn in school, they said, who is the first human being, who were on the top of the Mount Everest, then almost everybody in every country's youngsters and even elders, they say.

Sir Hillary.

And I said, wait a minute, there are many, Nepali Sherpas or not Sherpas.

They were there previously.

And are they not human being?

So there are many cases like that.

Columbus there were American Indians were there living there life for thousands of years.

And Maya, Inca, the Navajo, Mohawk and all there.

>>They weren't just discovered by Columbus.

>>Well this.

So this, kind of, learning, a learning this has to be relearned to learn or unlearn.

So this is an educational thing.

It's a like a in the, in the back of your a knowing elements, cerebral the parts has to be decoded in a way if it is Ektachrome you see realities more, bluish.

Kodachrome if you have that in the back of your mind or in the film at the, the real world has a red, more red pigment.

So I am interested in detoxing to purify wrongly ingrained, heuristics the things that you know.

So it's, education.

Yeah.

Trunk to to and also it comes from one sided view from, you know, so this world today is multi-directional and I hope, you know, this kind of wrong knowledge could be skinned off.

Delearning, detoxing, delearning, unlearning.

So that's a very interestin deschooling sometimes they say.

>>Well, thank you ver much for sharing your thoughts.

We'd like to talk to you more, but I know you have to have other commitments and we appreciate you joining us.

>>I'm sorry.

In a way, because I didn't want to get into the the nitty gritty stuff.

But for a meeting like this, I thought, I should be more, you know, philosophical side, health or holistic side.

So I would I want to make an apology.

>>No, no, it was very, very insightful.

Appreciate.

Appreciate it greatly, thank you.

>>I appreciate that.

>>This concludes our series of conversations from the Bosphorus Summit.

We hope you've enjoyed them and that you'll join us again next week for another edition of Global Perspectives.